tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2447271489594435093.post1677810643119469796..comments2024-01-23T10:37:14.372-08:00Comments on Surburg's blog: Mark's thoughts: Penance, Purgatory, Indulgences and TwitterSurburg's bloghttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07471674105191295804noreply@blogger.comBlogger2125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2447271489594435093.post-75125340816033641432013-07-18T07:02:58.183-07:002013-07-18T07:02:58.183-07:00Benjamin,
Thanks for your interesting question, ...Benjamin, <br /><br />Thanks for your interesting question, because I must confess that I haven't really thought about it in these terms. With Luther at the Debate at Leipzig, Lutherans recognize that councils can and do err. For this reason, the issue of which councils are "ecumenical' is not really a pressing theological question. We are more interested in what the councils actually said and how it relates to Scripture. <br /><br />If we were to identify the ecumenical councils, I guess they would be the traditional first seven - simply because both east and west were present to some degree. But note this is simply using "ecumenical' as a description of the make up.<br /><br />Lutherans think more in terms of creeds - that is why the Apostles', Nicene and Athanasian Creeds are the first three items in the Book of Concord. Naturally in this list the first and thrid have a western origin, but I believe we would say that they accurately represent the faith confessed by the apostolic and catholic Church (recognizing of course the disagreement about the filioque between east and west). <br /><br />In Christ,<br /><br />Mark SurburgSurburg's bloghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07471674105191295804noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2447271489594435093.post-85293694402642913922013-07-17T18:16:22.804-07:002013-07-17T18:16:22.804-07:00Dear Rev. Surburg,
Thank you *very* much for t...Dear Rev. Surburg,<br /><br /> Thank you *very* much for this timely post. As a Catholic convert, I sincerely appreciate your desire to let your theological opponents speak for themselves. I'm always relieved to see extensive and thorough quotes from the Catholic Catechism whenever one wishes to refute her views - it suggests a spirit of charity and intellectual rigor that one so often finds lacking. <br /><br />In that same vein, I have a clarifcatory question to ask about something you wrote in your post. You said: "The Ecumenical Creeds provide the lens through which the Church reads Scripture. The Church confesses that if you read Scripture and come to conclusions that contradict the Creeds, you are reading it incorrectly." Catholics, unsurprisingly, wholeheartedly agree that ecumenical creeds from ecumenical councils inform our reading of Scripture. So far as I know, though, Confessional Catholics and Confessional Lutherans would disagree about just which councils were, in fact, ecumenical. (For example, Catholics would affirm the ecumenicity of Trent and confessional Lutherans would deny it). <br /><br />My question, then, is the following: For confessional Lutherans, what condition "P" suffices to make a council be an ecumenical council? Or, alternatively, what condition "P" does Niceaea I possess that Trent lacks (that makes Nicaea be ecumenical but Trent not)? Or, to ask the same question yet another way, if I'm trying to find out whether a given council is or isn't ecumenical, what condition "P" should I look for according to confessional Lutherans?<br /><br />Sorry to ask the same question three different ways - I've found that sometimes helps one to be understood better on the internet. I've never encountered a Confessional Lutheran's response to the type of question I'm asking above and I thought you'd be a reasonable source to inquire with. Thanks, in advance, for whatever reply you'd care to give.<br /><br />Yours Most Sincerely,<br />~Benjamin :-)Benjaminhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05102442242703124834noreply@blogger.com